Heya,
How are you all off-setting your CS + SS for Paragon’s Snap Ring dropouts? (DR2097 1.125" x 1")
Below are my settings for 16mm seat stays and 19mm chain stays. Would love to get some feedback.
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@Meriwether recently built his Ponderosa with those dropouts:
They are really small. Barely enough room for a 16mm and 19mm CS + welds. Maybe you can use a tapered 16mm and 19mm CS?
The CS is zero offset:
The SS was 3mm offset:
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This is the DR2096 with Sx = 1mm, Sy = 9mm, Sz = 11.2mm, Cx = 10mm, Cy = -2.5mm and Cz = 11.2mm. The only difference between the DR2096 and DR2097 is that the DR2096 has a flange width of 22mm while the DR2097 has a flange width of 25.4mm. I have not included the DR2097 in BikeCAD, because Paragon does not supply a 3D STEP file for this particular dropout. However, if you are only concerned with a side view, the DR2096 and DR2097 will be identical.
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So the root of the question is this:
I need to order new drop-out blocks for my Sputnik SS + CS fixture. Jeff asked what my preferred offset is and, I hadn’t really considered it. I just made it work on the fly . . . let’s call it “finesse”. And since I’m back to having access to some machinery, I’d like to get this dialed in once and forget about it.
@Daniel_Y Thanks for your response! Would you agree that DR2065 might be a better solution for “hardier” hardtails and DR2097 might work better for the gravel crowd and light XC?
If DR2065 is a better option, the same question applies.
CS offset seems to remain 0 (zero)
SS offset seems to do well around 17-18mm.
@BikeCAD Brent, can I ask how you arrived at the Sx/Sy and Cx/Cy measurements in BikeCAD? I’m happy to take these as “gospel” but am curious about how you got there.
Thanks Gents.
This is my thought process: DR2065 gives you more room to land stays so you can use and you can use straight gauge chromoly (19mm). The freedom is more conducive to building mountain bikes because they often require custom bent chainstays.
DR2097 really only works with tapered stays. The dropout looks great if you are using off-the-shelf chainstay. But if you are trying to do “cutting edge” tire clearance and chainstays, the off-the-shelf chainstays will reach their limitations quickly.
DR2097 looks better in my opinion!
No experience with DR2097 / snap ring dropouts but like the look of them. As an end user of a bike with DR2065 though I would not reccomend them for the use described. I’ve got a them on a gravel bike (that I ride like a MTB) and I’ve gone through half a dozen hangers. I feel like the hanger design doesn’t stand up to even moderate impacts.
The same bike is now sold with Paragon’s Syntace dropouts, DR2092. Might be an option for ya! They’re 1.25" OD x 1" so not quite as large in diametre as the DR2065 (1.5" OD x 1") but slighly larger than the DR2097. Chainstays are 19mm straight guage and seastays are tapered 16mm to 12.5mm which I’d say means Columbus Zona.
When you select any standard dropouts in BikeCAD, it will always default to Cx, Cy, Sx and Sy values that should be reasonable. If it’s a socket style dropout, you won’t want to change these numbers at all. However, if it’s a hooded dropout like the DR2097, you do have some discretion to attach the stays in a way that suits you. If you use the hidden line display mode, you can see how altering values for Cx, Cy, Sx and Sy will change how the stays intersect the dropouts.
Depending on the angle and the diameter of your seat stays, you may need to adjust Sx and Sy to fit your particular configuration.
I often like to use the Export to FreeCAD option to view the model in 3D and make sure that the stays fit with the contours of the flange which is usually rounded off at the ends.
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I used the DR2096 on many bikes back before UDH and when I was fillet brazing frames. It’ll fit 19mm chainstays and 16mm seatstays, but just barely. Like @Daniel_Y showed in his drawing, you only have a few mm of offset to work with if using a straight 16mm stay.
If UDH weren’t a thing I’d still be using them. I love how compact they are. Unlike @bushtrucker I haven’t had any problems with the hangers bending, but I’m not a big risk-taker any more.
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